What is Lent and why do we observe it?

[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign. [00:00:16] Speaker B: Hey, welcome to the podcast. This is a podcast intended to help equip you to love God and love others and engage the world with the good news of Jesus. And so I am here. My name is Brad. I'm one of the pastors at Redemption Hill. I'm here with one of our other pastors, Matt Allen, who's been a pastor. How long have you been Pastor Matt at Redemption? [00:00:39] Speaker A: Oh, my goodness. Two years. [00:00:41] Speaker B: Two? Really? No, it's been three. [00:00:44] Speaker A: Oh, I was gonna go less. [00:00:45] Speaker B: Three and a half. I think it's been three that a year and a half. We're five year old church. Yeah. He's been a pastor for a long time for us at Redemption Hill. And so we're going to talk about Lent today, given the fact that Wednesday on the day of this recording. And so we're just going to dive into a few questions about what Lent is, why we think it is not an obligation for Christians, but a good thing, a good opportunity for us as believers, followers of Jesus. And maybe you're here and you're not yet a Christian and you have no idea what this thing called Lent is or what it means to be a Christian. And we're just really glad that you're here, if you are, and hope to maybe hit on some of those questions as well. But before we do that, we'll. We're gonna start with a conversation starter. So, Matt, I've got a question for you that I've been thinking about that I'm pretty excited to ask you. And I actually have two questions. So in real time, I'm trying to think of which one I wanna do. Lock in on. This is the one that it is. Okay, Matt, who is the greatest raw talent artist alive today? [00:01:47] Speaker A: Oh, my goodness. [00:01:48] Speaker B: And why are we talking music? [00:01:51] Speaker A: Music. [00:01:51] Speaker B: Yes. [00:01:52] Speaker A: Oh, my goodness. [00:01:53] Speaker B: Yeah. For those who don't know, Matt leads our music at Redemption Hill. So he is not on staff. You are on st. You are staff now. Very part time. But he, he works as an engineer, but does a great job leading our music. [00:02:04] Speaker A: I do. Okay. Greatest raw talent artists on the planet. So you know me. My, my favorite artist is a man named Gregory Allen Isakoff. I think he is tremendous. He. He writes music that underscores the background of my life. Moments of rest, moments of joy, of celebration. We're going to see him. [00:02:31] Speaker B: Yeah. September. [00:02:33] Speaker A: September. Can't wait. But your question is different. Your question is the greatest raw talent. [00:02:40] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:02:41] Speaker A: Which is not who I enjoy the most or listen to the most. [00:02:45] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:02:46] Speaker A: And I feel like has, you know, My brain is working through a list of. I'm an engineer. You mentioned that. So I'm going to a list of scoring parameters. Right, so like musicianship, instrumental ability, vocal talent, classical training. A very, very controversial answer, but there's a guy named Jacob Collier that is the most polarizing musician probably on the planet. [00:03:20] Speaker B: Yeah. What makes him polarizing? [00:03:22] Speaker A: Some people think he's a genius, some people think he's a scam artist. So it's really hard. You were just talking about leaders in certain spheres and how if you have the right personality and can communicate in a certain way. So Jacob communicates musical concepts in a very ethereal sense. And he does things. He, he truly does things that I think are remarkable. [00:03:48] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:03:50] Speaker A: But he, he is not. He's very polarizing. [00:03:55] Speaker B: Yeah. So interesting. All right, what second question to piggyback off of that. Who would you collaborate with if not Greg? If can't choose, I can't choose. Who would you collaborate with on an EP? [00:04:07] Speaker A: Oh, my goodness. Okay, so it is, it's 2015. My brother in law and I take a road trip to Denver, Colorado, and while we're there, we run into some of his friends. And throughout the course of the day we're making our plans and we end up at a record shop with 20 people. 20 people in this small record shop in downtown Denver. And that evening, a man named Shaky Graves plays an unbelievable set to 20 of us. So at that time, and since, I mean, Shaky has, has absolutely blown up, he is an incredible musician, vocally, instrumentally, songwriting. So I, I've, I've always looked back at that evening and it's, it's almost felt surreal in a way that I, that I had that experience with 20 other people in a small record shop and just watching what, what he did with, with his music, I've always left thinking, man, I wonder what it'd be like to sit in a room, just play some music. With Shaky. [00:05:31] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:05:32] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. [00:05:33] Speaker B: That's pretty awesome. [00:05:34] Speaker A: Yeah, it was unbelievable. [00:05:36] Speaker B: Inside story about the first time you introduced me to Greg. Oh, yeah. That probably is not worth telling on a podcast, but good answers, man. Okay. I'm not going to give mine. [00:05:46] Speaker A: Okay. [00:05:47] Speaker B: Because I don't know the answer to that question. But hey, let's, let's just start with a really high level question of what is Lent? So maybe you are listening to this whether you're, you're involved with Redemption Hill, involved with another church, you're a Christian and you're like, I thought that was a Catholic thing. I thought like, you know, we are Baptists. Why are we talking about Lent? Why do we say that this is something that we believe is good to do? It's not an obligation, but it is good. [00:06:15] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:06:16] Speaker B: You and I were talking before the show, Matt, and you read a passage from Joel 2. Yeah, that'd probably be a good place to start if you would. [00:06:23] Speaker A: Yeah, I'd love to. So this is Joel 2, starting in verse 12. And it reads, yet even now declares the Lord, return to me with all your heart, with fasting, with weeping and with mourning, and rend your hearts and not your garments. Return to the Lord your God, for he is gracious and merciful, slow to anger and abounding in steadfast love. And he relents over disaster. So when I, when I think about the season of Lent, I think about it through the lens of the Christian response to this call from the Lord to return. There's. There's so many things in our lives. There's distraction, there's work, there's good things, there's family, there's bad things, there's things that we run to that we know we shouldn't, that perhaps aren't sin, perhaps aren't explicitly wrong. But within the noise of our lives become to be the things that gather our attention, take our focus. And so for me, the season of Lent is for the Christian, a very helpful season to return to the Lord, to look at the landscape of our lives, set our priorities, and with resolve say, the things of the Lord are the things that are of utmost importance to me. So that's His Word, that's communing with his presence, that's obeying his commands, that's looking more like Jesus. It's a season for you and I, for those of us who follow Jesus to, with resolve say, these things matter to me more than anything else. [00:08:19] Speaker B: Yeah, that's good, man. So just to give some, like, very. Again, like, if you're listening to this and you're like, I have no idea what this means, that passage helps define it really well. I mean, even we've talked about this, just kind of like focusing in on the word return. Like it's an, it's a, it's a season, it's an opportunity to return. And to be more specific, it's a 40 day season. Yeah, Right. So this is how the church has observed this thing called Lent for a long, long time. Is it is the 40 days leading up to Good Friday, which is the day historically we believe Jesus died on the cross under Pontius Pilate, was buried and then Easter obviously is the third day. That's the Sunday that he rose from the dead. And so the 40 days leading up to that is what we call Lent. And it's just an opportunity, as articulated man just, it's an opportunity for us to look across the scope of our everyday life and ask the question, what is something that I can temporarily set aside for the purpose of focusing more on Jesus? The only thing I would add, and maybe this leads to the question of. I thought this was a Catholic thing you had mentioned before the show. I don't know if you have an answer to this, but you had said John Calvin did not like Lent. [00:09:43] Speaker A: That's what I learned. [00:09:44] Speaker B: That's what you learned. Do you have any idea why? [00:09:47] Speaker A: So I'm, I'm not as steeped in the history as I'd like to be. I did some research. I think, I think a lot of the reformers, not all of them there, there was a season of transition where it seems Protestantism embraced the season of Lent. But like anything, there's a spectrum of a response. And some of the response on the spectrum indicated a belief that Lent was a man made tradition without scriptural basis and again, without doing deep history. I can, I can understand the position, but I think what we're not, what we're not talking about in the season of lint is, is a man made must do, check the box for any reason to earn favor or righteousness. But as really, as you mentioned, I love your language. An invitation, right? So lint, like anything when approached through the wrong framework, through the, the wrong motivation, I think can be unhelpful, right? If we, we know this of, we know this of ourselves and of our own spiritual pursuits with the Lord. Anytime where the things we do precede our identity in Christ as beloved sons and daughters, anytime that order of operations gets flipped, we start living out in an unhelpful way. The Gospel reminds us that we are in Christ first, beloved, and then because of that identity through grace driven effort, [00:11:52] Speaker B: we respond, yeah, yeah. I think that really, it kind of leads to our next talking point that we wanted to address, but just the confusion, the potential confusion over something that I think we all struggle with, which is if I give this thing up, whatever the. And some, just to be clear, this might go without saying. I mean, there are things we need to give up, right? Like there are for those of us who are Christians and this is for Christians. If you're not a Christian man, what we want to do is invite you to Jesus to respond to Jesus, for the Christian, there are things in our life that just are not good. Whether they're, you know, it's, it's something that the Bible explicitly tells us not to do or to be a part of. Like we just grace fueled efforts. A good phrase, like by the power of the Spirit. Want to turn from that, to put that off and put on this new identity we've already been given in Jesus. But a lot of us struggle with legalism, like this kind of thought in the back of our mind of like God's love for me, his acceptance of me really is based on what I do or do not do. And what we're saying is that that can't be the case. So much of the New Testament speaks specifically against that way of thinking. And so, you know, Lent is not a time for that. You know, the way sometimes I, I've been thinking about this for my own life is, you know, the New Testament speaks a lot about our position before God. So if you are a Christian, if you've put your faith in Jesus, then your position before God is a saint. You're a son or daughter of God. You've already been forgiven of your sin. Paul says that I have been crucified with Christ and it's no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me. So we are hidden with Christ in God. The way the Father sees us is through Jesus and His perfection, his righteousness, his obedience. And that's wonderful news. That means you and I are, are free. We're free to live as sons and daughters of God, empowered by His Spirit. And so, you know, setting aside something for Lent, whether it be food or social media or whatever, is not going to make you more right with God. You could not be more right with God than you are right now. But experientially. So if that's our position, experientially, our, the, the closeness we feel with God, Lent can be a help to that. [00:14:24] Speaker A: Yep. [00:14:24] Speaker B: You know, and so, man, I'd love to hear from you, Matt, because you've probably observed this longer than I have, I'm sure. Like what, what have been maybe some experiences in your own life in observing Lent that have actually aided in, in your relationship with Jesus. [00:14:41] Speaker A: Yeah, so your language is really helpful here. When, when we talk about fasting, you often talk about fasting to feast. And I think that underscores that this idea that Lent as a season can experientially help the Christian in their communion with the Lord. And so, so personally we have, there's, there's been seasons where we've been very by the book, if you will. And I've struggled on, on one side, wondering, okay, man, now this sort of feels like a program. There's been seasons where we've been looser in it and I've been encouraged, oh, I think we can do more, I think we can pursue more. I think there's more Jesus to be had here. But for me, there's been, there's been times through these seasons where we have been very focused on that idea of rejecting things in our life to pursue more communion with God, whether in the church or whether in our home with Katie and I or with our boys. And so there's times where today I'm fasting from food. I know you're fasting from food today. I'm hungry. [00:16:08] Speaker B: Me too. [00:16:09] Speaker A: You know, it hasn't, the hunger pains haven't fully set in yet, but, but they haven't. [00:16:14] Speaker B: I smell food everywhere I go. [00:16:16] Speaker A: Let's stop talking about food, okay? It's, it's walking throughout the day when the, when the hunger pains hit. It is a, it is a physical reminder of my dependence. And I use that physical reminder to go to prayer, to go to the Lord. There's things we do through the season where we'll fast from social media for a week, we'll fast from the news, we'll fast from a strong desire, we'll fast from screens before bed. We will walk through the season as best we can and observe a 24 hour Sabbath where we set aside work for the day and fully focus our attention on the family and time with one another. We, we memorize scripture in the home. And, and it is, it is the elevation of these things to the declining of the others that could take our time, that are fine and good things that really has through the seasons where we, we've observed Lent been really beneficial to, to me in my household. [00:17:41] Speaker B: Have you or do you experience a time in the midst of all of this, in the midst of Lent and kind of heightening your focus on the spiritual disciplines where you begin to struggle with legalism, like you begin to struggle with like a thought, like if you don't do whatever, whatever thing you set out to do, let's say you don't do it. [00:18:01] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:18:01] Speaker B: Okay. You're like, I'm not going to eat today. And then by lunchtime you're like, I have to eat. And then you probably going to be [00:18:06] Speaker A: a quick trip hot dog. Something that I will feel guilty about for multiple reasons. [00:18:13] Speaker B: But let's say you do that. How's. They're all beef. [00:18:16] Speaker A: Right. [00:18:16] Speaker B: They're all. How do you. That was sky, by the way. Sky's one of our church members. He's recording for us. What do you do with that? How do you respond to that? [00:18:29] Speaker A: Yeah, And I. The. The temptation is certainly there. That's why I said we've. We've walked through seasons where we've been rather by the book and somewhere we've been looser. And I think it is just a. A reminder of the true motivation. Right. Which is part of what we're going to discuss today. Not, Not a checklist, not something we must do, not something that earns us favor, but the true hope is more of the Lord through our pursuits. And so, yeah, I don't do lint perfectly because I don't do anything perfectly. So the question is really just a use case for how do you live life not being perfect? Right. And I think. I think the answer is a remembrance of the Gospel. [00:19:26] Speaker B: So we're going to define at the end of this. [00:19:28] Speaker A: Good. Yeah. So there's. There's a lot of. There's a lot of grace for me. There's a lot of grace for you. There's a lot of grace for everyone as we stumble imperfectly towards the. The right goal of loving Jesus more. [00:19:45] Speaker B: Yeah, that's good. So one of the questions that I have somewhat related to that is why we observe Lent, which I feel like we've talked about, like why we think it's a good thing to observe Lent. You had mentioned communion with God. Can you define what that means? [00:20:05] Speaker A: Yeah. Communion with God to me is living. Living a life. Deuteronomy 6 has a beautiful. A beautiful set of words that talks about the story of God being as frontlets in front of our eyes. Frontlets were things that obscured the vision of the wearer, connected to perhaps a headband. And it's this idea that their entire life, as they walk through it, is seen through the vision of what's right in front of them. I think communion with God is around that same idea. It is the fact that the Lord is with us always. He goes before us. He is constantly at our side. And we can live in such a way that recognizes that. So communion with God, I think can allude to moments of silence and solitude, prayer of reading, but I think it more broadly extends to a life that is lived before the face of God, recognizing that everything we see and experience is through the lens of who he is and who he's made us. [00:21:36] Speaker B: Yeah, that's good, man. Yeah, yeah. That phrase was when I became a Christian, relatively new. And I probably like many, I don't know, you know, you hear the good news of the grace of God and what he's done for us through Jesus, which, like I said, we'll articulate that at the end. Um, you hear that and it's amazing. And you're like, oh, my gosh, like Jesus, you know, Christ died for us while we were still sinners. It's just the most amazing news in the world. You hear that, you put your faith in Jesus and then somewhere along the way you start to kind of live the Christian life. Like it's a set of rules. Like you're just like this. I'm just supposed to not do these things and do these things. And that's just how we think about the Christian life. And so the idea of communion with God, of. I think you articulated this, Matt, like it's life with God. [00:22:24] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:22:25] Speaker B: And, you know, I mean, this is kind of high level theology for just a moment to kind of nerd out on the idea of God being a Trinity is God has always lived in communion for all of eternity. The Father with the Son with the Spirit. And to be a Christian is to be grafted into that, that we get to on this side of heaven, though imperfectly have moments and glimpses of what communion with the Father and the Son and the Spirit, what life with the Father and the Son and the Spirit, and being kind of wrapped up into the love that the three members of the Trinity have for one another. Being wrapped up into that as a child of God and getting to experience that man. If Lent gives me an opportunity to do that, I want to take it. Yeah. Because of what you said earlier in the show, which is like we are super distracted. [00:23:14] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:23:15] Speaker B: What would you say are some of the greatest distractions that we experience now? [00:23:20] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:23:20] Speaker B: That might keep us from experiencing that level of like intimacy with God. [00:23:25] Speaker A: Yep. I think there's a variety. We talked about this last week. I think for many of us just how prevalent screens are in not just our day to day, but our hour by hour. Yeah, right. It is, it is a. It is a terrifying thing when your phone gives you your end of week screen time report. [00:23:56] Speaker B: We're not going to say what ours is on the show. [00:23:59] Speaker A: An hour, five minutes. Yep. So whether that is, whether that's social media, whether that is videos, again, some of it's good, some of it. I mean, those things are redeemable, but it takes so much of our attention. So screens in general media in general, I think the pressures of just being a person, an adult, a student, a human in 2026, whether that's providing for your family or the felt pressure to perform in your career or, you know, all of the things wrapped up into putting bread on the table, I think news. I think the news cycle is helpful. And as Christians, we certainly want to. To be informed. It can go too far. [00:25:07] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, Everything. [00:25:09] Speaker A: Everything good can go too far. [00:25:10] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:25:13] Speaker A: Yeah. And then there's, you know, a million. A million other things. I think. I think a helpful. I think a helpful sanity check for an individual wandering through these thoughts for them is where does my time go? What causes anxiety and fear? And what do I desire? What do I want? Like, I have one of the most addictive personalities that I know. I am. I am laser focused when I. When I want to go after something. My wife knows this, and it has benefits and not benefits. So for me, when I think about my life, when I think about my desires and my passions, that. That's also usually a helpful leading indicator of things that could have downfalls and be distracting. [00:26:10] Speaker B: Yeah, that makes sense, for sure. Yeah. So in thinking about, you know, if, let's say, Lent provides us an opportunity, it's not an obligation for Christians. We've already established that. So if. If Christian, and you're like, I don't want to do it. You don't have to do it. Like, it in no way affects your standing before God. Jesus alone is our hope. Right. So we just want to continue to beat that drum for those of us who do see it as a good thing, as an opportunity to experience more of this communion with God, this life with God that we already have in Jesus, but to experience it more, to taste it more, to set aside some things, maybe that aren't as helpful in our life for a season to do that, if we could. I think sometimes it's helpful for me when people paint a picture at the end of something and say, this could result from you doing this, like, this. This good thing could result. What would you say, Matt? Like, what are some of those things either that you've seen in your own life, like good results from observing Lent, or maybe that you've seen the lives of others or maybe that you hope for this year. [00:27:21] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. So I'll lead in with a story. It's just earlier this week, we're at the dinner table. I get home, and there's a lot going on in my professional life. It was a stressful day at the office, and I was feeling rather Anxious. And we're at the dinner table and I ask Zaid, our oldest, if he'll go get my Bible. And we take a moment just to read Mark 1 and 2. It's the, the text for the day that we've been reading together as a church. And I, I explained to Zayd that the reason I wanted to, to break during dinner and consume the Word of God together was because as I live my life, there are many voices that I can listen to. And I'm trying to explain this to him in a way consumable for a six year old. Right. But I'm explaining how I can be anxious if I listen to the voices of the world or prevalent voices within the workplace that don't align with the Gospel and point to the story of Jesus, the words of God as given to us by his spirit through the Bible, as a, as a reminder of the true voice that I want to set my life upon. And so I think the idea of Lent you asked about just helpful results, what could be. I think that is a meaningful result for me, that I also pray for our people that through time in the Word, through rejection of good things to the embrace of better things, that they would be more foundationally standing on truths that perhaps they've always known, but for a season, for whatever reason, are struggling to believe functionally through their lives. I also think of just stirred affections. [00:29:48] Speaker B: Right. [00:29:48] Speaker A: You and I both know we've been walking with the Lord for a long time. You talked earlier about our positional reality with God and how often there's a bit of a gap between that and our experience walking with Him. It is a good thing for the affections of the church to be stirred such that they love the Lord. Right. There's a bit of a intangibleness to that, but I think you and I both know what it feels like when we feel the communion of the Spirit and we're walking in step with him and we're. We're not living our life in such a way that all of the distractions are the loudest voices that get to our heart. So I think, yeah, I think of standing firmly on truths that perhaps we know, but functionally struggle to believe due to any reason. I think of increased affections and then also just think of increased knowledge like it's. It is a good thing to grow in the knowledge of the Lord. I think Lent can be a season, whether, whether you're a new Christian who just came to saving faith a week ago or whether you've walked with the Lord for your life. I think, I think lint can be a season where through study and solitude and prayer and communion with God and each other, where our knowledge of him increases, which carries us through seasons ahead leading to future growth. [00:31:35] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, that's good, man. Yeah, I, I'll just make this statement assuming that every human on the planet wants this. I really want to be happy. Yeah, I love feeling happy. And I think, you know, we were having a conversation before this about kind of like old. We say old within the last decade kind of reform culture. We are reformed, by the way. But, but, you know, there was, there was this really strong like, aversion to happiness. I don't know. You remember this whole sermons podcast preached on this idea of like, be joyful, don't be happy. Or it wasn't said that way, but that was kind of the idea that I got. So. But I think happiness and joy oftentimes in scripture synonymous with one another. Like God is a happy God. And if you think about Jesus on earth like he, yes, man of sorrows, acquainted with grief, he walks with us in our suffering because he himself has suffered and experienced human suffering beyond anything we'll ever experience on the side of heaven. But he was also happy. And the reason he was happy was because of his communion with the Father by the Spirit. And you know, and so the statement I've been thinking about, just as it pertains to lent is Matthew 4, the temptation of Jesus. Jesus went 40 days without eating in the wilderness, being tempted by Satan. And right in the middle of that passage, as Satan tempts him to turn the rocks into bread, Jesus says, man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that comes from the mouth of God. And I'm just like, man, I think that, you know, that is motivation for me. Like if Jesus had this sort of, you know, just this kind of otherworldly joy in his relationship with the Father. And I'm not Jesus, obviously, but if I am through Jesus, invited into that same thing, to be reminded that, you know, the things of this world as wonderful and glorious as so many of them are, like setting it aside so that I can remember that I do not live on bread alone, but by every word that comes from mouth of God, like I want to, I want to take that invitation. And in addition, man, I think even just thinking through character wise how, how heeding to the invitation to, To. To do Lent could lead to character growth and development. I think you mentioned this, but even just self control, yeah, just learning to be a more self controlled Person by the power of the spirit. Because I am similar. Like, I. It's hard for me to resist. Like, just, I get a craving for food, I go and get food, get a craving for drink, I go and, you know, whatever. The thing is just an opportunity to practice. You don't have to follow that craving every time you get one. [00:34:27] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:34:28] Speaker B: And, you know, rather than doing that, see it as an opportunity to open the Bible again, not in a legalistic way, but in a way to just like, oh, like I get to, for just a moment, feast on. On like true bread, like spiritual sustenance. I think we all need to detox. You mentioned the news. Like, man, we just societally are unwell. And I think many within the church, like, we just mentally, emotionally, spiritually, because of the kinds of things that we're taking in on a minute by minute basis, are. Are more unwell than we think we are. And might this be an opportunity to just kind of detox from that for a moment? [00:35:10] Speaker A: Yep. [00:35:11] Speaker B: And. And you know, it's like if I ate fast food every day, three meals a day, it'd be great. It'd be. It would that not. It'd be delicious. But you end up like the, the McDonald's guy. Who was a McDonald's guy. [00:35:23] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. [00:35:24] Speaker B: Anyways, got to kind of detox from that. [00:35:27] Speaker A: Yep. [00:35:27] Speaker B: Yeah. One more question and then I want us to share the gospel at the end of this. [00:35:34] Speaker A: Yep. [00:35:34] Speaker B: And I'll explain why in just a moment. But for somebody who has an interest in observing Lent for the first time. [00:35:43] Speaker A: Yep. [00:35:44] Speaker B: How might they do it? [00:35:45] Speaker A: Yeah. So I think. I think a helpful framework is thinking through the lens of the questions that I posed earlier. What are my desires? What are my fears? What are my passions? And through that self investigation, because the Spirit is generous, I think that he can and often does and would lead someone to an understanding of perhaps what would be helpful to reject for a season. And it could be. It could be many of these things that we've already been talking about. It could be a call to fast from food for a day. It could be a call to reject social media for a season. Could be a call to give up the news or watch their screen time again, not in a legalistic way, but. But in a way that pursues the heart that we've been discussing. One that wants to reject in order to embrace the better things. And I think it's. I think it's that. I think it's that second half that is really important. The. The rejection of something Jonathan Edwards always talked about the explosive power of a new affection. So we can reject something, but something will take its place. Right. And so lint is not about putting away screen time for a different, lesser pursuit. It's about pursuing the greater things. Communion with God, time in his word, prayer, increased dependence on him, growth, maturity. And so I think for someone interested in walking through the season for the first time, and we have lots of other resources that we're walking through as a church, we're walking through weekly fasts for those that really want to engage. I have kind of a model of how the Allen family walks through this season that has paired with fasting, a focus on spiritual disciplines, all in the name of the same pursuit of the Lord. But for someone brand new, doesn't know where to start. I think I would ask the questions to myself and ask the Lord to lead me to understand what would be helpful to reject for a time and then ask the Lord what practical ways I could seek to replace whatever that thing was with more of Him. [00:38:46] Speaker B: Yeah, that's good, man. Yeah. You mentioned scripture, prayer, silence and solitude. These are what the church has referred to for, again, a long, long time as the spiritual disciplines. None of them save us, but they're all a means of relating to God. We open the Bible, we hear God speak when we pray, we speak to him sitting in silence and solitude. We're detoxing from the noise that just consistently fuels and fills our mind. And so these are again, just opportunities and invitations for more of Jesus. Yeah, so that's really good. I'm just going to add one quick thing, and as it pertains to fasting from food, there are some who just do not need to do that. Right. Like for medical reasons. For, like, my kids last night were like, I think we're going to fast. And I was like, no, you're not allowed to fast from food. Like you. We've. We're a small frame family and we need to eat. [00:39:42] Speaker A: They will, they will blow away. [00:39:44] Speaker B: Yeah, can't do that. So you missed meals. Right. So they're going to eat. So, you know, maybe, maybe you're like, I don't know if I should do that or you have some kind of like autoimmune thing. Like, you should talk to your doctor, obviously. Like, we're not medical professionals. We're not giving advice on that. We're just saying this is one of many ways that for those that it works for, you know, you can set something aside temporarily for the sake of, of relating to Jesus. [00:40:11] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. Your, your comment. This is an aside, but I'm reminded our. Our weekly content that we're walking with the church through does have family guides. [00:40:24] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:40:25] Speaker A: For each week. [00:40:26] Speaker B: That's awesome. [00:40:27] Speaker A: That are aimed at supporting parents having these conversations with their kids, which. Which I would say is actually maybe a helpful result that we didn't discuss earlier of walking through the season is just increased understanding. Information in our children. [00:40:44] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:40:44] Speaker A: Understanding the ways of the Lord and knowledge of who he is. Lent is a season where, Zayd, if you. If you ask Satan, he. He will tell you that Lent is when we fast from things to have. Have more of Jesus. I'm going to choke that. And that's amazing. [00:41:07] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:41:07] Speaker A: Yep. [00:41:08] Speaker B: Yeah, it's awesome. All right. At the close, I think it'd be really cool for you to share the gospel with us. And I'll give just a very brief kind of, like, introduction into the. Why just the thought. So I started listening to a podcast recently, which I think I love. It's called 9941. It's Granger Smith, a country music artist, and went through a family tragedy. And I don't. I think it was through that maybe that he became a Christian, but. But now he's a pastor at a church. And they've got this podcast, and it's all about. They would say it's all about equipping the 99 to reach the 1, which I think is awesome. And at the end of every episode, one of them shares the gospel. And I was like, man, I love that. Like, that'd be a really cool thing for us to do. And especially in light of this conversation, again, around. What we are not talking about is how to be right with God. We're not talking about how to be saved from your sins. We're not talking about how to be forgiven. And so if you would. Matt, like, I am a non. Like, I am not yet a Christian. We'll pretend. Okay. I'm sitting here and I've got questions about God. I'm feeling the weight of my own imperfections. I would love to go to heaven when I die. What do I need? [00:42:22] Speaker A: Yeah. In short, you need a substitute. We have a problem, you and I. The world at the beginning of all things. As you mentioned, God existed in perfect communion with Himself, Father, Son, and spirit. Out of joy, he created all that we know and see. The vast universe, stars, and our planet. He created a garden where things were perfect, things were without sin, without brokenness. He created animals. He created sea and sky and trees. And at the. At the pinnacle of his creation, he created man yet unbroken, not marred by sin, perfect in his image. But then things broke. And we know things broke, at least experientially, because you and I, regardless of your view of the world, you know things are broken. You have to wear the most rose colored glasses to believe that all things are well. And so sin, through disobedience of God's creation, entered the world. And when it did it, it caused the problem we have where humanity no longer is positionally right with God until He makes it so. Right. So sin entered the world. Adam and Eve were sent from the garden. But in Genesis 3, the Lord promises to send a Redeemer to crush the head of the enemy. And throughout the narrative of the Bible, we, we see a covenantal God making promises to his people as they are unfaithful to him, which, which is a comfort, I think, to people like you and me, as we see God fulfilled promises despite the unfaithfulness of his people. And so the gospel of Jesus is a recognition that mankind has a problem, that sin is a problem. The Bible says that the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Christ Jesus our Lord. And so because of God's perfection, communion with him requires perfection, which is another huge problem, because I'm not perfect. [00:45:26] Speaker B: Are you? Are you? Some would say, okay, yeah, I believe that actually nobody would say that. [00:45:35] Speaker A: I, I've not, I've not ever actually spoken with anyone that, that genuinely would put their name on the line that they believe they are perfect. [00:45:46] Speaker B: Yep. Right. [00:45:48] Speaker A: And so perfection is, is the requirement for communion. You and I are not perfect. And so the, the problem at hand, the question is how, how can one be saved? And so Jesus enters the picture and he is sent by the Father to be the perfect substitute for mankind. So he is born of Mary, he grows up as a carpenter. He emerges in public ministry at the age of 30. And throughout his entire life the Scriptures proclaim he lived perfect and without sin, like you and I, in every way except without sin. He lives perfectly. He's the substitute that, that we need for people who are not and will not and cannot be perfect. And then as a sacrifice he is put to death. And it's our death that is deserved, but it is his that goes before. And so there's, there's a text, very famous verse in the Bible, 2nd Corinthians 5:21, says for our sake, he being God, made him Jesus to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him, in Jesus, we might become the righteousness of God. And So this is, this is the, this is the exchange and this is why identity matters. This is why it's true earlier when you said there's. There's nothing that we can do to be seen as more holy than God already sees us. Because God doesn't view us through the, the sin that is still indwelling that we struggle with. He views us through Jesus. He looks at Jesus's perfect life and he accounts that to us. He looks at Jesus's death on the cross and he counts that to us. And so the, the gospel, the good news of Jesus is that sin is a problem. Perfection is required. You and I can't do it. But in his grace, God made a way by sending Jesus. And for those who believe and are saved, everlasting life and communion with God in the, the next life, in the life to come, God will come again, consummate all things, fix all brokenness, and will live forever with him. And it'll be glorious. And I can't wait. [00:48:52] Speaker B: Praise God. Yeah, it's good news. Yeah. So if you are a Christian and you just heard that, I mean, I would encourage you to go back and listen to it again. We talk a lot at the church about like, how do you share your faith, how do you share the gospel with people in your life who do not yet know Jesus? Which is what we should all be about. Like, that should just like drive so much of our desire in daily life. And I want it to more in me is man. How do we see more people come to faith in Jesus? That's, that's a great way to do it. And if you are not a Christian and that is the good news that is available to you and the invitation is to you mentioned believe. It's, you know, the, the wonderful thing about news is it's not something that needs to be worked out. It just is. It's something that's happened. And so the invitation is to respond by repenting, turning from your sin and believing upon Jesus, believing that what he did for you is enough. Because it is so, man. It's been a great conversation. Matt. Thanks for coming out, doing this. [00:49:55] Speaker A: Thanks for having me. [00:49:56] Speaker B: Yeah, we, we appreciate everybody listening and hope that this Lent season is filled with communion with God for you. Thanks. [00:50:30] Speaker A: Sat.